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cheys03

Help me with MK3 rear suspension - Fitting a Rear ARB

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cheys03

I've currently got a Spax -40mm all round kit with non-adjustable shocks. G-Laderseite blocks for the front.

However, I'm not really happy with the rear setup. The Spax kit is harsh at the back, but great at the front. It doesn't look quite right with the -40mm all around - should have gone 60/40 perhaps. I'd prefer the rear to be a bit higher and a little softer, without sacrificing too much handling... if possible.

So, what to do...?

1. Replace front springs with -60mm

2. Replace rears with coilovers capable of say -20mm drop and comfortable springs

3. Replace whole kit with H&R 60/40 kit

4. Get lowering front top-mounts (not really happy with this option)

5. Replace rear with standard shocks & springs

6. Other suggestions...??

Thanks for you help, this one's really got me in a spin..!

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MikeyMK

Use standard rear springs and quality standard replacement dampers,with one coil chopped off the bottom end of the spring (or you'll damage the top mount). Then use a Rover 400 rear arb.

I am,and its sweet. But prepare to be told your inside rear wheel lifts off the ground in anything resembling a corner..

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steveo3002

more infos on the rover arb please

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philpheasant

Could use G40 rears approx 15mm lower than standard.

Haven't heard of the rover arb mod before, any more info??

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mark_crox

I would go for

3. Replace whole kit with H&R 60/40 kit

And Rear ARB .... Rover 400....

o_rly.jpg

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mikey_v-dub
:lol:

whats this rover 400 rear arb thing ? sounds interesting!

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MikeyMK

Mine is from a Rover Tomcat coupe turbo,and is 20mm thick,which is a bit silly but gives it that Clio Sport look in corners.. And more importantly,keeps it from squatting under acceleration in corners and my inside front wheel gets more traction.

I'm sure other Rover 400s and probably bigger engine wedge-shape 200s will have the same thing but i dont know.

I used the Rover drop links (having given them a slight twist with some grips) and bolted them to the part of the rear beam the damper bolts to. The bar i bolted to the beams cross member using the rover mounts. Six bolts and six holes to drill,took half hour.

My laptop's buggered,hence there's been no pics from me for a while,but i'll get some pics up when i can.

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mikey_v-dub
Mine is from a Rover Tomcat coupe turbo,and is 20mm thick,which is a bit silly but gives it that Clio Sport look in corners.. And more importantly,keeps it from squatting under acceleration in corners and my inside front wheel gets more traction.

I'm sure other Rover 400s and probably bigger engine wedge-shape 200s will have the same thing but i dont know.

I used the Rover drop links (having given them a slight twist with some grips) and bolted them to the part of the rear beam the damper bolts to. The bar i bolted to the beams cross member using the rover mounts. Six bolts and six holes to drill,took half hour.

My laptop's buggered,hence there's been no pics from me for a while,but i'll get some pics up when i can.

that sounds mint deffo having a go at that ! just ordered some rear coilovers too so ultimate stifness from the rear soon! cheers mikey :)

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Renegade440
:lol: Mikey you ledgend!

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cheys03

Thanks for the input guys.

I'm currently thinking stock springs (probably with 1/2 to a coil removed off the bottom by saw) and keep the Spax rear shocks. See how that combination works out. If it'll still too firm then the Spax shocks will be swapped for Bilsteins probably.

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MikeyMK

Pic, as promised..

arbos.jpg

Parts used - Rover 200 coupe/400 rear bar and bushes. Rover 200 coupe/400 front drop links. Suitable bolts/washers. Nylon spacer blocks to give adequate room for my 50mm exhaust (probably wouldn't be needed with stock exhaust,though my hangers are far stiffer). Bar still sits higher than the front brace,almost clears a 440ml beer can.

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jimmy7

fair play, that looks down right professional aswell :thumbsup:

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mark_crox

Cool!!. I might nick that idea of you don't mind? I've been waiting for a rear arb for a while.

That set up will be now known as the MikeyBar!

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MikeyMK

The Mikeybars on me! :lol:

Yeah the 400 bubble has a slightly thinner one,about 18mm same as the stock Polo front. But that'd be plenty. This 200 coupe turbo one is the thickest at 20mm and sorts the handling right out. More grip and traction on the front because both wheels are planted better,and not slightly skittish at the back probably because there are eight bushes altogether,helping dampen that first half inch of travel.

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Andy

Interesting way of doing it! Looks plenty beefy enough for a little Polo!

We've been wanting to offer one for ages, but still playing around with designs to get something that'll work well and clear most people's exhausts without dragging on the floor.

Back in the day some of the G40 boys used to bolt a beefy flat piece of steel across the rear axle for a simple solution to supplement the original item. Hywell on here did something in a similar vein on his Mk2 Polo rally car.

Have you had any problems with the drop link pulling through the section of the rear axle you've bolted it to, or breaking the fittings?

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MikeyMK

The drop links are from the front of a front engined,front wheel drive,1200kg 2.0 16v turbocharged car,and are more than up to the job of the tail of this shopping trolley,which is so light i can lift the wheel a couple of inches off the ground with ease.

Yet still its fitted up both ends by M10 bolts - only the next size down from the bolt that holds the damper to it.

Rover's testing standards i know little about,British standard i expect. TUV. CE. That sort of thing.

The part of the chassis on the Polo is stronger than the part of the chassis on the Rover,as its about the same thickness if not more,but wider and a rigid unit fixed at multiple points instead of a single point fixed protrusion as with the Rover. And there's little leverage on it from that point. So this is well over engineered,as the whole lot is designed to handle at least double the loads it does now just in normal use.

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Andy

Mikey, I'm not on about the strength of the drop links themselves - though being a Rover part I'd expect they'll break long before any bits of Polo... ;)

It looks in the pics like you've drilled in to the 2-3mm thick box section that the damper mounts to, but only one side of it. Without modelling it properly and running it through FEA neither of us can say whether it's fit for purpose - but my original question is still a valid one. Whilst the bush in the drop-link will dampen some of the forces, I'd be more comfortable knowing that there was a big fat washer or re-enforcing plate helping that M10 spread its load - which perhaps there is.

Go careful with an uber-stiff arse end. The G40 Cup Cars used to run stiff at the back to dance round the bends - but they can catch you out, I turned up at Donington once to see a friend barrel-roll his Cup Car when the rear end caught him out.

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B-shaw

I just don't know how you come up with these ideas Mikey haha!

How does the exhaust clear this?

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mark_crox
I just don't know how you come up with these ideas Mikey haha!

How does the exhaust clear this?

I guess it goes between the beam and the bar.

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prankstar2003

Wow, nice idea. Have you ever had a gt rear arb fitted? How does it compare to your rover one?

Also, regarding the OP, what effect would shortening the rear damper be? I'm thinking of chopping off the thread from the rear shock, then re-threading the shaft. Is it going to bottom out a lot? Could I chop the bumps down to get over this?

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MikeyMK

Like i say Andy,the drop link is mounted the same as it is on the Rover,but the part of the axle is stronger. I'm not gonna start taking measurements of everything,but the shaft through the bush has the diameter of a penny coin,the bolt and washer are the size of the ones holding the front TCA to the body,and you can see the angle and reach of the bar puts the load to the base of the bolt and not the head of it.. There's no leverage on it.

The G40 cup cars had little damping of the ARB,it was all metal but for the axle bushes,being welded to the axle. This is very different as its highly damped - there are four bushes visible in that picture,plus the axle bush. Eight bushes even the GT/G40 road axle doesn't have. Again,I've said its not skittish.

Grip is impressive. I used to enjoy throwing the back end out tbh,it could slide at jogging pace in the damp on provocation when standard. But it grips very well now no matter how fast and tight the corner,and even on a trailing 1.6 throttle. I'm sure it has its limit like any car,but id be stupid to find it.

Course,every car is different. So just because mine behaves a certain way,there's no guarantee the next is gonna handle the same. That goes even with standard cars,let alone modified,so i can only report my own case as i always do.

Its been fitted for a few months but its been off the road lately so its still fresh. If i get any problems i'll report them.

Prankstar - i have no experience of heavy rear end lowerage. But unless you lower the spring platforms then shortening the piston will do you no good. Still,as most of the hash ride of the TA-Technix kit is through the front,id just use those rear dampers to go very low.

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prankstar2003

I didn't mention, i'd be using shortened springs too, to the same extent as the dampers. So essentially just shortening the whole of the rear set up. This should lower the car right? Or am I missing something :retard:

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Yeti

Celver stuff. Could you not put it on the other way up to improve ground clearance?

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